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Jacob
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Post subject: Dining out in America... why so boring? Posted: Fri Sep 17, 2004 4:24 am |
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Hi !
In the following, I am not America bashing –really, I love America; I’m asking in order to learn / discuss a point!
I am from Denmark, and my lover and I just had a great vacation in America (N.Y. , L.A. S.F. and Napa Valley). We had so much fun. As we are great fans of food and vine we off course planed to dine out at some of the nicer restaurants. To my big surprise all the food seamed uninspiring! It was as if everything was nice – but boring – mainstream sort of … When I dine out, I like my food to be inventive, new … it’s not that I have to like it all, actually I prefer not to … that way I know that it’s selective, as opposed to mainstream. There is a saying in marketing “If you try to please everyone, you please no one” … and that’s what I think most of the restaurants did. To mention some of the places we tried, “Aureol” in N.Y. was the worst most pretentious snob place I ever did visit! Actually the best place we found was a “hole in the wall” Creole place called “T.J’s gingerbread house” in Oakland, California.
What do you think ??? I’d like to hear some opinions.
Best regards Jacob
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The reckless chef
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Post subject: Posted: Fri Sep 17, 2004 4:00 pm |
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Joined: Sun Feb 29, 2004 8:15 pm Posts: 189 Location: Montreal Canada
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Well ,from my experience when dining in the U.S. I have found that if you are willing to pay the price you will truly find an inspiring meal. Unfortunately the cost will be quite high and most people are not willing to pay that price. I am very fortunate that I live in a city that has unbelievable cuisine wherever you go at a very reasonable price. Again not all of Canada is like that. Most resaurants,as you mentioned gear themselves for the masses and the cooks,not chefs,in the kitchen follow a certain pattern for every plate they serve. The cook has his/her recipe to follow and they follow it to the letter. You have to go to a fancier restaurant where the owner is the chef and he only knows that morning what he is making that night according to what was freshest at the market that morning. Europeans tend to buy fresh ingredients everyday and cook accordingly where as we north americans usually go grocery shopping once a week to accomodate our pre planned menus. If you ever decide to come to Montreal I can give you a list of great and inventive restaurants to go to. Skal
_________________ The Reckless Chef
I Live To eat
Last edited by The reckless chef on Sat Sep 18, 2004 1:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Knockdonagh
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Post subject: Posted: Fri Sep 17, 2004 10:31 pm |
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Joined: Mon May 24, 2004 11:24 pm Posts: 60 Location: South Australia
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Hi
As your new princess was born 'down under', why not come and try Australia's 'fusion' cooking, which is an innovative way of combining the many different cooking cultures which flourish here.
Because Australia extends from the cool temperate to the tropic zone there is scarcely anything that is not in season somewhere and is flown to the capital cities within four hours of picking.
Dine on the waterfront in Sydney, overlooking our fabulous harbour, stroll Melbourne's Ackland Street where the coffee and cakes are to die for (not die-t for!), come to Adelaide where the red wines are legendary, stuff yourself with fresh mangoes and free-range beef in sunny Queensland, try the fabulous fish restaurants of Fremantle (on the coast near Perth), eat fresh oysters along the coast of island Tasmania. And Australia has some gorgeous-tasting 'bush foods' which were used for thousands of years by the aborigines and are now being farmed for rerstaurant use.
Our dollar is pretty good at the moment, so come on down.
Cheers.
_________________ Anna
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Knockdonagh
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Post subject: Posted: Sat Sep 18, 2004 3:32 am |
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Joined: Mon May 24, 2004 11:24 pm Posts: 60 Location: South Australia
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The reckless chef
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Post subject: Posted: Sat Sep 18, 2004 8:06 am |
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Joined: Sun Feb 29, 2004 8:15 pm Posts: 189 Location: Montreal Canada
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Vous savez si je prends un petite vacances "Down Under" c'est pas pour deux ou trois jours. C'est pour un minimum de trois semaines. Actuellement j'en ai les cousins qui demeure à Melbourne et peut être un jour je vas faire un petite visite. What city do you live in
_________________ The Reckless Chef
I Live To eat
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Knockdonagh
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Post subject: Posted: Sat Sep 18, 2004 9:45 am |
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Joined: Mon May 24, 2004 11:24 pm Posts: 60 Location: South Australia
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Allez -y! Nous habitons pres de la plage quatre-vingts kilometres d'Adelaide. Nous avons de place pour un ami.
Autumn is the best time here. Your spring.You will be moving fast to see half of what Australia offers in three weeks. Four days in Sydney, a week in Melbourne with your friends, four days in S.Australia, cross the Nullarbor to Perth? .....Mmmmm. Pity to miss the tropic beaches and rainforest of Queensland, the McDonnell ranges with white ghost gums twisting out of the red rocks...oh, shut up, Anna.
Have you seen 'La Turbulence de Fluides'? A Canadian film. It was shown on our multi-cultural channel and was very good.I could actually understand quite a bit of the French when the actors did not speak too quickly.
_________________ Anna
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The reckless chef
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Post subject: Posted: Sat Sep 18, 2004 1:06 pm |
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Joined: Sun Feb 29, 2004 8:15 pm Posts: 189 Location: Montreal Canada
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I would love to spend some time there but unfortunately I cannot leave my business for that length of time at this juncture. Hopefully in a couple of years I will be able to take a month off and go visit. We actually have two friends who are there right now for a month. Sold their business and decided to do some travel time. I noticed that you still haven't got the hang of the accents yet. á â è é ê etc,etc.
_________________ The Reckless Chef
I Live To eat
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Knockdonagh
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Post subject: Posted: Sat Sep 18, 2004 7:35 pm |
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Joined: Mon May 24, 2004 11:24 pm Posts: 60 Location: South Australia
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I can do the accents, circumflexes, umlauts and tildes on my Word 2000 but not on this format. Pretend they are there!
As we say here 'Haveagoodweekend.'
_________________ Anna
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Jacob
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Post subject: Whats price range are we talking ? Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2004 11:46 am |
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In Denmark a deacent meal out starts around 20 US$ for an entre and a great fixed price meal can be had for 60 US$ and up if you go to a micheling class restaurant we are talking 158 US$ for 1 person without wine ....
What should I expect to pay for the kind of chef you vere talking about "Reckless"?
P.S. - I dint speak french - sory!
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The reckless chef
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Post subject: Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2004 1:37 pm |
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Joined: Sun Feb 29, 2004 8:15 pm Posts: 189 Location: Montreal Canada
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Sorry about the french. It is meant for my Australian friend. In Montreal,and I will give you prices in U.S. dollars so that you can relate,a five course meal, consisiting of soup,salad your main course with dessert and coffee in a very good restaurant will cost about $20.00. If you go to what we call an upscale restaurant,a really fancy one,you will pay around $60.00 - $80.00 for an outstanding meal. These prices do not include wine of course. My wife and I have a favorite place that we go to and she usually has the lamb chops with salad,rice and potatoes and I have scallops wrapped in bacon with salad,etc and with tax and tip the meal usually costs about $22.00 for the both of us. This restaurant happens to allow to bring your own wine so we save with that feature as well. Montreal is known for its dining. I am lucky to live here for many reasons,and dining is one of them.
_________________ The Reckless Chef
I Live To eat
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Flash Gordon
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Post subject: I'll forgive the French if you'll forgive my 'southern'.... Posted: Tue Sep 21, 2004 10:26 pm |
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Joined: Sat Aug 31, 2002 5:29 am Posts: 125 Location: Elizabeth City, NC
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Around here we're less likely to find an 'upscale' place. We tend to feature restaraunts of character, many of which feature locally acquired seafood, etc. In addition, there is the North Carolina twist. We are somewhat noted for unique presentations of pork, even to what part of the state in which the pork is presented.
If you happened to visit my favorite watering/feeding hole (City Meeting Place) you may find specials like 'surf and turf' which will revolve around what is currently available and in season. I've enjoyed a repast there which was complete with wine and desert for less than 30 USD.
In my traveling days it was easy to find the 'upscale' restaraunt in whatever place I happened to be. What was difficult was finding the 'good' restaraunt. On the other hand, I often found the good place in the most unlikely little towns and burgs. I'm reminded of a little place in 'nowhere' Kentucky where I enjoyed absolutely the best pork loin sandwich I've ever tasted for under 4 USD. The establishment had previously been a Dairy Queen or something like it. It was a hole in the wall but it presented great food for a decent price.
Reckless, does this count as a rant? ;-p Hope I haven't bored you guys.
_________________ Flash Gordon
Where are we going and why am I in this handbasket?
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The reckless chef
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Post subject: Posted: Tue Sep 21, 2004 10:43 pm |
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Joined: Sun Feb 29, 2004 8:15 pm Posts: 189 Location: Montreal Canada
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It doesn't sound like a rant at all. "Comfort Food" is something we all crave for,be it the place that serves the best pork sandwich or that fantastic dish Mom always made for you. When we find a place that we like we keep on going back and that is why we are called creatures of habit. Sometimes though, we want to find something new and exciting to titilate our tastebuds and to sit down to a fabulous meals that is presented so beautifully that you want to take a picture of it. Then you take that first forkfull and you know right away that it was money well spent. I think that this is what our friend in Denmark is looking for. Not the humdrum everyday blue plate special that you find everywhere but something with pizzaz. When you do find such a place enjoy it to the fullest and go their every special occasion that you can.
_________________ The Reckless Chef
I Live To eat
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Ethnic Hash
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Post subject: Posted: Wed Sep 22, 2004 9:47 am |
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Joined: Wed Jun 23, 2004 2:55 pm Posts: 56 Location: Washington State
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I think the point that Flash was trying to make was that Upscale doesn't necessarily equal exceptional food. Although it does seem to me that some of the pricier restaurants do take more risks with their menus.
To ease some of Jacob's disappointment - typical american fare is pretty boring. It takes some searching to find those exceptional places. I'm not surprised that best place you found was a Creole place, as it has regional origins rather than national. It does surprise me that you didn't find any other interesting places on the west coast. Perhaps you will have to travel further north if you make it over again. "Pacific Northwest" cuisine - as it has been labeled - is what is referred to as 'fusion' style - not sure how to explain other than typical ingredients, but cooked with an asian flair. And that explanation is pretty limiting.
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Knockdonagh
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Post subject: Posted: Thu Sep 23, 2004 1:38 am |
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Joined: Mon May 24, 2004 11:24 pm Posts: 60 Location: South Australia
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These messages have made interesting reading. Don't you also feel that presentation has a lot to do with an excellent meal? The first thing we like to say is :'That LOOKS great.'
_________________ Anna
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